wow, what a revaltion i had today concercing progressions

[jeremyr]

Out of nowhere after struggling to really understand the 7-3-6-2-5-1 progression i came to realize that it follows the circle of 5th......SHIZA.  I've known the cirlc of fifths for AGES and always wondered what the point of it was....wellllllllllllllll :lol:  8O  :lol:



Yeah, I feel a little slow, but better now then never to seeing this stuff.  Seems like more and moer stuff is just clicking for me here lately.

[RWILLIAMS3000]

ok question can you help me better understand the circle of fifths please???

[elio]

There's recently been a long discussion of this very topic, you might want to do a search.

Practically speaking, a lot of progressions in Gospel music (such as the one above) include chords that are one fifth apart. So, the Co5 helps you find which chords are a fifth away from what you are playing now. Say you are in C and you are playing a Dmin7, you know that the next chord up is likely to be a fifth away, Gdom7. As for every rule, there are exceptions, which are what make a song interesting.

After playing for a while you won't think of it anymore though, you'll just know what comes after each chord in each progression.

[T-Block]

That's good yall finally catching on.  Once you get it, you'll smack yourself and say, "Why oh why didn't i think of that before?"

[jeremyr]

That's good yall finally catching on.  Once you get it, you'll smack yourself and say, "Why oh why didn't i think of that before?"

hey, did you get my second pm in reponse to your question?

[Musixman]

Can you please describe this in more detail?  I am new to music theory and not really sure what you mean.  I have a printout of the circle in front of me but where did you get the Gdom7 after the Dminor from the circle of fifths?   Thank You  Please help 8O

[jeremyr]

After playing for a while you won't think of it anymore though, you'll just know what comes after each chord in each progression.

I can relate.  Previous I would go in a key and try to remmeber which chord was 3 after plyaing 7 and I remember thinking to myself how on earth can people remember ALL of these like that.

Well if you can just find your way to one chord and know where you want to end up at the circle of fifths takes care of all of that.  Now ehen I'm playing I don't even think about what key I'm in except to start.  It's more like just moving around the cicrcle to get to where I want to go.  

This is a BEAUTIFUL BEAUTIFUL BEAUTIFUL THING!!!!!  I don't think that Icould stress how much of a headache learning and understanding the circle of fifths will keep you away from!!!

[jeremyr]

Can you please describe this in more detail?  I am new to music theory and not really sure what you mean.  I have a printout of the circle in front of me but where did you get the Gdom7 after the Dminor from the circle of fifths?   Thank You  Please help 8O

Some refer to it as the circle of fourths.  basically just move up to the 4th tone of the scale and play that chord.  That's how you get the Gdom7 from the Dminor

[Musixman]

Thanx for all of the help, but I wanted to know if maybe you could post more than just 2 different chords so that I could understand why going from a Dmin to Gdom7 to ? other chord so that I have more to work with.   and also how are Dmin and Gdom7 a 5th apart if your starting on a 2chord. I guess it would look like a 2-5-1 progression, but I guess the question is how do I know how to flow my chords and add color into them during worship instead of using the boring I-IV-V-VI chords in songs. Inot sure how to add chords or to change them to flow more easily and deeply into worship.  If you could please help me that would be great, even an email to: mrcs_music@hotmail.com would be great.  I've taken classical piano for 13 years but they never tought us theory just monkey see monkey do.  So if you could help that would be great 8O

[JoashStilltheman]

Okay I don't understand where the circle of fifths comes from coz in that 7-3-6-2-5-1, the chords look like they are fourths instead of fifths. For example in key of C:

B,E, A, D, G, C

[playhear]

Okay I don't understand where the circle of fifths comes from coz in that 7-3-6-2-5-1, the chords look like they are fourths instead of fifths. For example in key of C:

B,E, A, D, G, C

It's also called the circle of fourths, same circle though. Pick your naming preference.

G is the 5th of C; D is the 5th of G, etc.

When you use the Circle of 5ths you first have to determine the key you're in. All other notes (or chords) on the circle are then numbered relative to that key. For example, the 7-3-6-2-5-1 progression of the key of G is Gb-B-E-A-D-G; the 7-3-6-2-5-1 progression of the key of C is B-E-A-D-G-C, and so on.

[jeremyr]

When you use the Circle of 5ths you first have to determine the key you're in. All other notes (or chords) on the circle are then numbered relative to that key. For example, the 7-3-6-2-5-1 progression of the key of G is Gb-B-E-A-D-G; the 7-3-6-2-5-1 progression of the key of C is B-E-A-D-G-C, and so on.

For the sake of the namiing convention of the scale I think you should says F#-B-E-A-D-G oposed to Gb-B-E-A-D-B since you're talking of the G scale.

[playhear]

For the sake of the namiing convention of the scale I think you should says F#-B-E-A-D-G oposed to Gb-B-E-A-D-B since you're talking of the G scale.

Good point, my mistake, I was typing fast. However, in my head, I've memorized that note as Gb. I have memorized the Circle of Fifths in such a way that my recall of the notes is laser fast. Having 2 different names for certain notes, which happens a lot, would slow down my recall considerably. I understand your point though.

[B3Wannabe]

Depending on the key, I'll change what I call the notes, but generally, if I'm just talking about notes, I call them by their flat names, like you.

[JoashStilltheman]

Okay I don't understand where the circle of fifths comes from coz in that 7-3-6-2-5-1, the chords look like they are fourths instead of fifths. For example in key of C:

B,E, A, D, G, C

It's also called the circle of fourths, same circle though. Pick your naming preference.

G is the 5th of C; D is the 5th of G, etc.

When you use the Circle of 5ths you first have to determine the key you're in. All other notes (or chords) on the circle are then numbered relative to that key. For example, the 7-3-6-2-5-1 progression of the key of G is Gb-B-E-A-D-G; the 7-3-6-2-5-1 progression of the key of C is B-E-A-D-G-C, and so on.

Okay now I get it...

[aljeres]

Okay now I get it...[/quote]



i think everything that was said was confuseing! but that's just me!

circle of fourths and fifths the same? wow!

Gdom7 is a fifth away from Dmin7 wow!

a circle of fourths moves one way as you play, and a circle ot cycle of fifths moves another direction as you play it! plus the sound is entirely different!

dm7 is the fifth of Gdom7,
Gdom7 is the fourth of Dmin7 ............stop twisting it!

7-3-6-2-5-1 is a progression that moves in scales chord degrees of fourths!  not fifths! at all..........ever!

i really hope this makes things much cleare! i am sure they all said this, but it just didnt look like it from my view!

[Dooley]

I always call it the circle of fourths because it moves in scale degrees of fourths...If you are thinking backwards, it can be fifths, or if you think that chromatically the notes are 5 notes apart from eachother yeah...but i dont know...i thought the circle of Fifths moved in scale degrees of fifths...am i right or wrong about that??

[JoyCH]

That's good yall finally catching on.  Once you get it, you'll smack yourself and say, "Why oh why didn't i think of that before?"

I agree with that!  

Joy

[T-Block]

Remeber that the circle of 5ths/4ths has absolutely nothing to do with actual chords.  It is just keys and notes.  Here is how i look at each circle:

The circle of 5ths is used to show how many sharps or flats are in each key.  It is like a clock.  You start at the top with C that has no sharps or flats.  Then you move clockwise (to the right) to G, which has 1 sharp, then to D, which has 2 sharps, then to A, which has 3 sharps, then to E, which has 4 sharps, then to B, which has 5 shaprs, then to F#, which has 6 sharps, then to C#, which has 7 sharps. From there, you switch to flats with Cb, which has 7 flats, then to Gb, which has 6 flats, then to Db which has 5 flats, then to Ab, which has 4 flats, then to Eb, which has 3 flats, then to Bb, which has 2 flats, then to F, which has 1 flat, then you are back at C.  Here is an illustration:

C = 0 sharps or flats  
G = 1 sharp (F#)
D = 2 sharps (F#, C#)
A = 3 sharps (F#, C#, G#)
E = 4 sharps (F#, C#, G#, D#)
B = 5 sharps (F#, C#, G#, D#, A#)
F# = 6 sharps (F#, C#, G#, D#, A#, E#)
C# = 7 shaprs (F#, C#, G#, D#, A#, E#, B#)
(switch)
Cb = 7 flats (Bb, Eb, Ab, Db, Gb, Cb, Fb)
Gb = 6 flats (Bb, Eb, Ab, Db, Gb, Cb)
Db = 5 flats (Bb, Eb, Ab, Db, Gb)
Ab = 4 flats (Bb, Eb, Ab, Db)
Eb = 3 flats (Bb, Eb, Ab)
Bb = 2 flats (Bb, Eb)
F = 1 flat (Bb)
C = 0 sharps or flats
 
The circle of 4ths is where your progressions come from.  In other words, it has solely to do with bass/LH notes.  To me, that is the only significance of it.  Just take the circle of 5ths and read it backwards.  

See what I mean by keys and note?  Circle of 5ths is for keys and circle of 4ths is for notes.

[playhear]

Actually, aljeres, what you wrote is confusing to me. And I know theory.