LearnGospelMusic.com Community
Gospel Instruments => General Music Hangout => Topic started by: docjohn on June 02, 2009, 06:43:27 AM
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when using a 6/9 #11,isn't this a poly chord? Essentially this could be(in C) a D chord over a C bass;so why not D/C ? what uses for this chord? thanks!!!!!
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Actually, u would call that chord a D/C. And it's use is as a secondary dominant to a 5 chord. Something like this:
Key C LH/RH
C / G-C-E
C / A-D-F# *sec. dom. on the 2
B / B-D-G *resolution to the 5
This move is found in the song "I Love The Lord" by Whitney Houston off the Preacher's Wife soundtrack.
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thanks T!
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So far as modes go this would be a C Lydian. The corresponding scale would be the "G" major scale with the C being the tonic. Modes are very interesting and helps us gain lots of insight into what we do as keyboard players.
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So far as modes go this would be a C Lydian. The corresponding scale would be the "G" major scale with the C being the tonic. Modes are very interesting and helps us gain lots of insight into what we do as keyboard players.
?/? :-\
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So far as modes go this would be a C Lydian. The corresponding scale would be the "G" major scale with the C being the tonic. Modes are very interesting and helps us gain lots of insight into what we do as keyboard players.
Excuse me...as musicians not just keyboard players.
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Excuse me...as musicians not just keyboard players.
That wasn't the confusing part. It was the whole 'modes' thing.
I don't have a handle on them at. all. :-\
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So far as modes go this would be a C Lydian. The corresponding scale would be the "G" major scale with the C being the tonic. Modes are very interesting and helps us gain lots of insight into what we do as keyboard players.
While all that is true, this situation here has nothing to do with modal playing at all.
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That wasn't the confusing part. It was the whole 'modes' thing.
I don't have a handle on them at. all. :-\
1- Ionian
2- Dorian
3- Phrgian
4- Lydian
5- Mixolydian
6- Aeolian
7- Locrian
Example:
G mixolydian = Play C major scale but start on G (Tonic)
Bb Dorian = Play Ab major scale but start on Bb(Tonic)
The above chord is a C 6/9 #11. A C Lydian is simply a G major scale that starts on C that compliments this chord well, especially the #11 (F#). You would not want to play a regular C major scale (C Ionian) because it contains a F natural. This would clash with #11 unless you are purposely looking for this type of dissonance/de-harmonizatizing voicing.
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While all that is true, this situation here has nothing to do with modal playing at all.
All things are relevant in music. Once I started to understand that to be true I began unlocking many interesting ideas and approaches to those ideas. I hope this will encourage a stimulating dialogue with the intent on sharing knowledge with one another. I don't write to try and prove that I'm right or wrong, I just want to gain more knowledge is all. Let her rip! ;)
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That wasn't the confusing part. It was the whole 'modes' thing.
I don't have a handle on them at. all. :-\
We know that the Ionian scale is whole, whole, half, whole, whole, whole, half (WWHWWWH). So piggybacking off of jonesl78, you have the C Ionian to begin with. Dealing with the modes I've discovered (though it may have always been known) that reversing the ionian mode would help me unlock the modal puzzle. For example, C Ionian (WWHWWWH) is C, D, E, F, G, A, B, C. Reversing the Ionian mode (WWHWWWH) would result in C, Bb, Ab, G, F, Eb, Db, C. If I want to know what a C dorian is I would play a Bb scale beginning with the C as my tonic. If I want to play a C phrygian I would play an Ab scale beginning with the C as my tonic. C lydian would be a G scale, C mixolydian would be an F scale, C aeolian would be an Eb scale, and C locrian woild be a Db scale beginning with the C as the tonic. There's more if we can keep this going.
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We know that the Ionian scale is whole, whole, half, whole, whole, whole, half (WWHWWWH). So piggybacking off of jonesl78, you have the C Ionian to begin with. Dealing with the modes I've discovered (though it may have always been known) that reversing the ionian mode would help me unlock the modal puzzle. For example, C Ionian (WWHWWWH) is C, D, E, F, G, A, B, C. Reversing the Ionian mode (WWHWWWH) would result in C, Bb, Ab, G, F, Eb, Db, C. If I want to know what a C dorian is I would play a Bb scale beginning with the C as my tonic. If I want to play a C phrygian I would play an Ab scale beginning with the C as my tonic. C lydian would be a G scale, C mixolydian would be an F scale, C aeolian would be an Eb scale, and C locrian woild be a Db scale beginning with the C as the tonic. There's more if we can keep this going.
WOW, reversing the Ioninan mode, well the pattern of the Ionian mode. I've never even thought of doing that b4. This should be in my original post talking about modes. Me thinks I'm gonna add it. Dude, u just taught me something very valuable here. Great job!!! ;D
I wonder if my school teachers know about this.
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We know that the Ionian scale is whole, whole, half, whole, whole, whole, half (WWHWWWH). So piggybacking off of jonesl78, you have the C Ionian to begin with. Dealing with the modes I've discovered (though it may have always been known) that reversing the ionian mode would help me unlock the modal puzzle. For example, C Ionian (WWHWWWH) is C, D, E, F, G, A, B, C. Reversing the Ionian mode (WWHWWWH) would result in C, Bb, Ab, G, F, Eb, Db, C. If I want to know what a C dorian is I would play a Bb scale beginning with the C as my tonic. If I want to play a C phrygian I would play an Ab scale beginning with the C as my tonic. C lydian would be a G scale, C mixolydian would be an F scale, C aeolian would be an Eb scale, and C locrian woild be a Db scale beginning with the C as the tonic. There's more if we can keep this going.
This post was REALLY confusing. But, I figured out why.
You said 'reversing' the pattern of whole and half-steps. To ME, that means (HWWWHWW) which would mean, in C (C,B,A,G,F,E,D,C)
BUT, what you're REALLY saying is to play the pattern while DESCENDING a scale.
For example in F:
F, Eb, Db, C, Bb, Ab, Gb, F
Is that correct?
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This post was REALLY confusing. But, I figured out why.
You said 'reversing' the pattern of whole and half-steps. To ME, that means (HWWWHWW) which would mean, in C (C,B,A,G,F,E,D,C)
BUT, what you're REALLY saying is to play the pattern while DESCENDING a scale.
For example in F:
F, Eb, Db, C, Bb, Ab, Gb, F
Is that correct?
Yes, that's correct.
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Yes, that's correct.
Excellent. The next question, I guess, is when would one use these modes?
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Excellent. The next question, I guess, is when would one use these modes?
You must've missed all my mode posts about two/three years ago.
;D ;D
I'll put them in a new thread--downloadable even.
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You must've missed all my mode posts about two/three years ago.
;D ;D
I'll put them in a new thread--downloadable even.
How soon bro.? I would like this info as well!
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How soon bro.? I would like this info as well!
Already posted:
http://www.learngospelmusic.com/forums/index.php/topic,66911.0.html (http://www.learngospelmusic.com/forums/index.php/topic,66911.0.html)
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You must've missed all my mode posts about two/three years ago.
;D ;D
I'll put them in a new thread--downloadable even.
There were too complicated.
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There were too complicated.
LOL! Probably!
Especially since I was just learning it myself, so I probably wasn't able to convey the concepts properly.
I remember posting the same thing Dwreck posted (http://www.learngospelmusic.com/forums/index.php/topic,31683.0.html), but with a different spin on it.
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LOL! Probably!
Especially since I was just learning it myself, so I probably wasn't able to convey the concepts properly.
I remember posting the same thing Dwreck posted ([url]http://www.learngospelmusic.com/forums/index.php/topic,31683.0.html[/url]), but with a different spin on it.
That is some incredible stuff dude! i'm loving it!!!!! You're gonna make me call in sick so I can chat with you all day and pick your brain. Incredible!!!!! :)
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Excellent. The next question, I guess, is when would one use these modes?
So, I'm back to this question ^^^^^^^
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I'll second that question, SJ.
berbie
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The main way that I use modes is with runs. Most of my runs consist of the major scale notes. So, whatever note I start the run on, I just run the major scale up or down until I want to stop.
I don't consciously think of what mode to use, I just look at it as I'm playing the major scale. That's just me though, maybe so other LGMers use modes more.
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So, I'm back to this question ^^^^^^^
What I am discovering is the use of modes while playing chords built on fourths, ie., F-Bb-Eb. When playing a chord of this nature I have found that you can play, Gb maj, Ab maj, Bb maj, Db maj, & Eb maj. This happens to spell out the Gb69 chord & each of these scales entails the three notes of the chord being played. Bare with me if you're not getting this as I am still working with this. Also, you can play a Ab minor (w/maj 7), Bb minor (w/maj 7), & Eb minor (w/maj 7). I want to figure out how to incorporate the modes with each type of chord and memorize the scales that can be played with each type of chord so that I can have an array of scales at my disposal that will work so long as the resolution is sound. Hope this makes sense to yoy all.
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Modes are very useful when you want to find a complimenting scale with an altered chord. For example you can play a regular C Major scale ( C D E F G A B) with a CM13 chord (C E G B D F A). However, this Major scale will clash with the chord if the chord is altered; For example C13 or CM13b7 ( C E G Bb D F A). It would be useful to incorporate another scale such as the C mixolodian.((F major scale)C D E F G A Bb) This scale contains the b7 or dominate 7 that is need to accompany the C13 chord.
A chord that contains all major intervals will usually go with any mode with respect to the original key.(i.e second degree scale of C, D minor, will go with C ionian, D Dorian, E phrygian, etc) because they all contain the notes of the C major scale.
Modes are not limited to the major scale. They can be used with any scale. For example,the chord C7b9b13( BbDbEAb)could be used with a C mixolodian harmonic minor scale
( F harmonic minor scale - C Db E F G Ab Bb)
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yo Jones,about your CM 13th;is that really a chord? I thought once you went to the 7th and beyond,it was an implied dominant 7 th(Bb).
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yo Jones,about your CM 13th;is that really a chord? I thought once you went to the 7th and beyond,it was an implied dominant 7 th(Bb).
Its really a chord. C E G B A = C Major 13
C E G Bb A= C dominate 13
C Eb G B A = C minor major 13
The 7th determines whether you have a dominate or major 7th chord. Also the 7th has to be present in order to have a 9th, 11th, or 13th with the exception of the add9( CEGD)