Transcribing and arranging music: "By-the-book" vs "creative interpretation"

[SketchMan3]

When does "exact duplication" end and "creative interpretation" begin, for you?

When you're learning a new song, do you try to learn all the little nuances, changes, and chord substitutions that the original recording uses, and THEN start improvising your own ideas? Or do you implement your own ideas as you go along, like "That turn around isn't necessary, I'll just play it straight" or "Oh... I didn't realize they were playing a C9, not a C7. Oh well, I'll just stick with the C7".

If you learn it one way, then hear the original recording and think "Hey, that way sounds pretty nice, and it gives it more variation" do you go on and add it, or just keep playing it the way you always do?

An aunt and I were learning a song together, listening in the car. I'm accompanying her on guitar. It's a very jazzy/r&b-ish style with the main accompaniment on keyboard and bass, with a lot of subtle chord changes and substitutions. I've memorized the song well enough to where we can perform it without the CD, and I've been playing it all afternoon.

But now that I'm at home to listen to it on my good speakers, I hear a few different bass notes, and some chords that are just a little different than what I was playing, and I can't decide whether to learn all that, or just stick to what's stuck in my head.

What would you do?

[T-Block]

Me personally, I first try to learn a song as close to the original as I can. However, when I perform/minister the song in church or wherever, I rarely play it the way I learned it. Why? Because it won't go the way the CD has it. People like to repeat parts, add in other parts, so u gotta be quick on your toes.

My advice is to play it the way you want to play it. Besides, if you have a talk with any of the musicians from the CD, they will probably tell you that they won't ever play it that same exact way again, so why should you.

BTJM!

[jgause2]

Me personally, I first try to learn a song as close to the original as I can. However, when I perform/minister the song in church or wherever, I rarely play it the way I learned it. Why? Because it won't go the way the CD has it. People like to repeat parts, add in other parts, so u gotta be quick on your toes.

My advice is to play it the way you want to play it. Besides, if you have a talk with any of the musicians from the CD, they will probably tell you that they won't ever play it that same exact way again, so why should you.

BTJM!

This.


Just to add on, for me, i'll initially learn it the way the cd is. I'll analyze the song for anything new that I may not have caught on to at first, or never heard before (diff progressions, chord changes, etc.)  Then I adjust what I learn to fit my style of play, and that's where the creativity comes in....whether its an extra passing chord, and extra progression change, or whatever, creativity begins when you depart from the originator's style to your style, which ever that may be.

[sjonathan02]

It also depends on for whom you're playing the song.

For example, if it's just you and your aunt, then you work the song out for the two of you.

But, if you're learning it for a singer, and the two of you can't rehearse together for whatever reason, you may to learn it as close to the CD as possible, then after you and the singer get comfortable, you can change it up.

[under13]

That depends on who you're playing for. If your playing for the artist, then yeah, you wanna learn that stuff. Even some directors will want you to play it as close as possible.

You have to remember though that it can be nearly impossible to do that unless you have a full band. I was at a workshop with Aaron Lindsey who produces for Israel , and he said that he first lays down the piano track, then the Fender rhodes, then maybe another sound. No way one person can do all that live and have it sound just like a record, or maybe some of these beastly cats can...

Anyway, I dont do that because its not required of me.

[floaded27]

so already its not "by the book" because you arent even on the same instrument. i'd call it "structured interpretation" if you'd like a phrase.

as for me, based on the artist i already know there's a lot of stuff i wont be able to do. im not on this guy's level. there's sort of a reason he's on the CD and im not. I'll go back some months later and get more when im better.

i've also discovered its very hard (and frustrating) to stick to the CD, when everybody else isnt. When the singers are in left field doing original stuff, and the organist/keyboardist is doing their own thing, you walking the line is hard to do. You're the one thats "wrong". I once got put on blast for doing a move that was literally note for note of what the guy did on the CD. Many times i get the "what are you doing" look, and many times i wanna say "im playing the song. what are YOU doing!?" but since im the less experienced guy, i just gotta shut up and "correct" what im playing.

But I still learn and practice like the CD, and then I turn the CD off and try to play the new variations. I think the biggest thing is being able to identify whats part of the song, and whats part of the player. Some things are on the CD because thats what they decided to play THAT particular time and every other time before and since then its been different. Some things are the same every time the song is played. Sometimes you can easily point those out and that clues you into what u need to get exact. The rest is your interpretation, but getting whats done on the CD just challenges you and adds a few new moves to your arsenal.

That depends on who you're playing for. If your playing for the artist, then yeah, you wanna learn that stuff. Even some directors will want you to play it as close as possible.

This is not so bad, unless the artist just replace the entire band, because at least you'll be able to work with other musicians who know the songs CORRECTLY and can help out to an extent.

[berbie]

When you learn a song by reading the music or listening to a cd and you play the song over a period of several months and then go back to the cd or the music, it is alarming sometimes how much you changed it. Your playing style just kinda creeps into the song.

[jlewis]

What's even more  funny.  Sometimes I will learn a song pretty close to the cd,   then later by the sheet music.    Many times the sheet music  doesn't have the nuances ( runs, riffs, fillers)  that make the track on the cd  special.

Also many times, the music is transcribed early  in the  recording process,  but the cd is a live recording   and therefore the artist has added additional flavor.

if you were to hear the cd    performed live, you would also be surprised by how different it is from a studio based recording.


Jlewis

[GospelEngineer]

I've started learning songs note for note from the recording. This not only makes it sound the same but helps me learn new voicings, chords, and runs.

[Fingers!]

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so already its not "by the book" because you arent even on the same instrument. i'd call it "structured interpretation" if you'd like a phrase.

as for me, based on the artist i already know there's a lot of stuff i wont be able to do. im not on this guy's level. there's sort of a reason he's on the CD and im not. I'll go back some months later and get more when im better.

i've also discovered its very hard (and frustrating) to stick to the CD, when everybody else isnt. When the singers are in left field doing original stuff, and the organist/keyboardist is doing their own thing, you walking the line is hard to do. You're the one thats "wrong". I once got put on blast for doing a move that was literally note for note of what the guy did on the CD. Many times i get the "what are you doing" look, and many times i wanna say "im playing the song. what are YOU doing!?" but since im the less experienced guy, i just gotta shut up and "correct" what im playing.

But I still learn and practice like the CD, and then I turn the CD off and try to play the new variations. I think the biggest thing is being able to identify whats part of the song, and whats part of the player. Some things are on the CD because thats what they decided to play THAT particular time and every other time before and since then its been different. Some things are the same every time the song is played. Sometimes you can easily point those out and that clues you into what u need to get exact. The rest is your interpretation, but getting whats done on the CD just challenges you and adds a few new moves to your arsenal.

...at least you'll be able to work with other musicians who know the songs CORRECTLY and can help out to an extent.

Dude, you're kicking things around in my backyard!  I would accuse you of plagiarizing but I don’t remember seeing you around when I was going thru this.

...if you were to hear the cd    performed live, you would also be surprised by how different it is from a studio based recording.

True, but sometimes those guys do live performances so on-point that it seems like they're lip synching to a cd.

[docjohn]

All good stuff-except for the "shop spam".

There's always value in doing the author justice vs the musician insanity of "note for note" when as somebody said if I were @ ThaT level-I would be on the CD.

[musallio]

I struggle to play note for note.

I find that my style creeps in.

I strive by all means to do what one of my first inspirations who has recorded a couple of albums told me:

- If you perform someone else's song, make sure that you do it just as good as them [no necessarily note for note, but make it sound just as good] or make it sound better.

When playing a church with the whole congregation singing along, like someone has said, try to have the key stuff in there, but I find that the note for note thing is not practical...i only works if rehearsed with everyone.