Being Maninpulated

[kodacolor]

Question:  To the MoMs or leaders with other leaders under them...

How do you deal with being manipulated?  I know I've been manipulated by the leadership I'm over and it's been working because I don't know how to handle it.  I'm so done with this.  I should be able to trust and depend on these people.  They're yankin' my chain because they know they can and I have no clue as to what to do about it.  Other than prayer and "tell the pastor" how should I deal with this?

P.S:  I know someone is going to ask, "are you sure," and I'm telling you I'm 300% sure.

[under13]

Manipulated how?

[kodacolor]

Manipulated how?

Doing things behind my back, making excuses for why they can't do something so they can get out of the work, pretending, I've was manipulated into some stuff about ministry policy (which never came to fruition, thank God)...

These are people that I've known since I was a baby.  They've been over my house when I was a kid and are/were friends of my parents so trusting them wasn't hard. 

I guess I should plead insanity because time after time I'd ask them to do something, they wouldn't do it, I'd confront them, they'd smile in my face and tell me they forgot and would do it next time, and next time would come and it still wouldn't get done.  But when you don't know what to do what else can you do?  There's more but I don't think you guys want to read a novel.   

[under13]

Are you the MOM? It sounds more like they arent respecting your position, than manipulating you. I say you need to put your foot down and tell them that you wont be taking any more of their mess. If you have to go to the Pastor then do so; have a meeting where everyone's role is defined and they are given rules to be followed.

[kodacolor]

Are you the MOM?

I'm the Music Administrator.  I'm over the entire music ministry and I work the Administrative side of things.  When it comes to dance, choir(s), musicians, and praise and worship I have leaders under me who run those areas.  I have no problem, as of yet, with the dance ministry.

It sounds more like they arent respecting your position, than manipulating you. I say you need to put your foot down and tell them that you wont be taking any more of their mess. If you have to go to the Pastor then do so; have a meeting where everyone's role is defined and they are given rules to be followed.

I'm trying to do that.  My pastor wants to give leadership roles and stuff at this up coming meeting and I'm going out of my mind because I could have sworn he did this already.  I don't know what he's going to do or say and I don't know if I'll agree with it.  I know his heart is in the right place, but still...

Whenever I try to instate a rule (for example) "if you don't come to rehearsal you don't sing/play" I get responses like, "What about the people who can't make it?  You can't set this in stone because there are people who want to be on the ministry who won't be able to make it!  Saturday is a really bad time to be doing this anyway.  You're trying to make this ministry about you!"  (sjon, I know we talked about this, but the aforementioned cycle ends up happening or the guideline just doesn't get passed)  It's annoying because not only does this come from the leaders it comes from the choir thanks to prompting from a leader. 

[sjonathan02]

Quit or lay your cards on the table. It's the only two options you have, really.

Laying your cards on the table says, "I know what's going on and it MUST stop."

Quitting says, 'You're NOT hearing me and I DON'T have to endure this."


The truly last option is laying your cards on the table WHILE quitting which says, "I KNOW you're doing X, Y, Z and no one seems to care that I know when I bring it up; so, I'm out!"


Put up two fingers and bounce. Now, you don't have to leave that church, per se, you just don't have to endure all that mess.


Anyway, that's what I would do.

[betnich]

     Trust is essential for the ministry - and a hard thing to regain after it has been lost.

     Sounds like some are trying to get around your guidelines for their ministry. Maybe because of age and/or experience they resent someone who is not the Pastor giving them rules and making them accountable. If that is the case, they may have problems accepting your authority - a bit like a child saying 'you're not the boss of me!' or a class behaving with their regular teacher, but acting up when the substitute comes in.

My suggestion - for every rule you make -

(a) - clear it with the Pastor (ultimate authority, short of the Good Lord)

(b) - make the rule logical, reasonable and followable. Don't put on others anything you would not be willing to do yourself.

(c) - give a good, clear reason. For example, on rehearsal attendance, you could explain, "We need to be sure that everyone knows any new songs we practice before Sunday. For that reason, people who cannot make rehearsal should sit out the next Sunday service." Make any exceptions clear and rare.
 
The going behind your back is a side issue...but I know how that hurts...

[kodacolor]

Thanks everybody for your input

    (c) - give a good, clear reason. For example, on rehearsal attendance, you could explain, "We need to be sure that everyone knows any new songs we practice before Sunday. For that reason, people who cannot make rehearsal should sit out the next Sunday service." Make any exceptions clear and rare.

What would you consider a decent exception to the rule for attendance?

[betnich]

Rare and urgent circumstances such as catastrophe (like 9/11) grave sickness, accident or death in the family. Things like parties and soccer games don't count. I have sometimes offered to meet with the person privately to go over their part; that minimizes weaseling out of rehearsal. If they can't make time for that, well, that says a lot right there...

Even then, the missing person should know everything down cold, be otherwise dependable and downright crucial to the ministry. This rules out backup singers and cowbell virtuosos...

[cordney]

Things like parties and soccer games don't count.

I disagree!  If an individual has kids and their kids have soccer practice.  That to me, is a legimate reason to miss practice.  Another example, I'm in the military and can't make every practice that we have...should I be penalized because of my job.   

[sjonathan02]

I disagree!  If an individual has kids and their kids have soccer practice.  That to me, is a legimate reason to miss practice.  Another example, I'm in the military and can't make every practice that we have...should I be penalized because of my job.   

Penalized? No. At the same time, if you aren't at rehearsal, you don't play or sing. Things DO come up. Because of this, EVERYONE must govern themselves accordingly and adjust. One of those adjustments would be the parent not singing on THAT particular Sunday. No biggie; at least, it shouldn't be. 


I never understand why this is such an issue. Everyone is trying to bring excellence to the house of the Lord. Attendance at rehearsals is merely folks trying to bring about excellence.


In the case of musicians, perhaps there can be a separate rehearsal apart from the weekly rehearsal, like a make-up, if you will. 

[under13]

In the case of musicians, perhaps there can be a separate rehearsal apart from the weekly rehearsal, like a make-up, if you will. 

Thats exactly what we do. I work evenings so I cant make rehearsal, so we get the recording of the rehearsal and go over it on saturdays. They also email it to me, so if I miss saturday rehearsal, its no problem.

I think it also depends on the skill level and familiarity of the songs and how well you know each other.When you get to a certain point or level, your group should be able to perform well without practice. (Especially when it comes to musicians in a band) (am I off topic )