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Author Topic: Developing Licks With Arpeggios  (Read 7623 times)

Offline darkwing

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Offline chevonee

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Re: Developing Licks With Arpeggios
« Reply #1 on: November 22, 2007, 03:51:20 AM »
Quote
Improvising With Arpeggios

Are you tired of learning licks from friends and off of recordings? Have you ever wondered where all these licks come from? Who makes them up and what secret formula do they use? I would like to share with you some ideas for developing your own licks.

Let me introduce you to arpeggios. An arpeggio is playing the notes of a chord one by one. For example, a C Major arpeggio in root position is C, E, G. We'll call this a forward arpeggio. A C Major reverse arpeggio in root position would be G, E, C. Playing forward or reverse arpeggios up or down two or more octaves creates a harp-like effect. Start by practicing arpeggios with Major and Minor triads, then move on to seventh chords. Don't forget that you can play the arpeggios in any inversion. Instead of playing C, E, G, and then repeating this an octave higher, you could play the following: C, E, G, E, G, C, G, C, E.

So how do I know which arpeggio to play? Great question. Just because you're playing a C Minor 7 doesn't mean you arpeggiate the entire chord. You could just arpeggiate the C Minor triad. You could also arpeggiate an Eb Major triad as it shares the same notes with a C Minor 7. If you're playing a C Minor 9 you could arpeggiate a G Minor triad.

Hey, how about alternating between triads? On a C Minor 11 you could play reverse arpeggios of the following triads: C Minor, Bb Major, G Minor and Eb Major. This would be played as G, Eb, C, F, D, Bb, D, Bb, G, Bb, G, Eb.

And don't forget the multitude of possibilities with Dominant chords. You have so much freedom with Dominant chords due to their flexibility. Just because everyone else is playing a C7 doesn't mean you can't try altering it. After all, the third and the seventh are what give the Dominant chord its distinctive quality. As long as those notes are not changed, then core of the chord remains the same. The only time you should exercise caution with altering Dominant chords is when you are playing with singers. You have to ensure that the harmony that is being sung is not changed. If you only have a soloist then you only have to ensure that there melody is not affected. However, some soloists enjoy the addition of alterations as they may be more experience and be able to flow well with reharmonizations.

So let's say you don't have any restrictions on altering Dominant chords. Let's consider arpeggios over the C7 chord. Here are some of the main choices and their respective altered chord name:

Triad Chord Name

D Major C7(b5)

Eb Major C7(#9)

Gb Major C7(b5,b9)

Ab Major C7(#5,#9)

A Major C7(b9)

C Minor C7(#9)

Db Minor C7(#5,b9)

Eb Minor C7(b5,#9)

Gb Minor C13(b5,b9)

G Minor C9

A Minor C13


Now that's a lot of fodder! Put this list in front of you when you're playing and experiment. Mixing and matching any two of these provides over 100 combinations. Of course you'll want to do this for every dominant chord, so this leads to over 500 combinations! You can only imagine how many combinations you get with three or more triads. Trust me, I'm an applied mathematician ;) If you use two, then try playing one forward and the next reverse. For example, if you choose to alternate between D Major and Eb Major over a C7 chord, then play the following: D, F#, A, Bb, G, Eb, F#, A, D, Eb, Bb, G, etc. If you use three different triads, then you have nearly 1000 combinations!

Could someone please explain this bolded part to me. Ok I know that the triad to D is D,F#,A
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Offline darkwing

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Re: Developing Licks With Arpeggios
« Reply #2 on: November 22, 2007, 05:03:24 AM »
If the triad on the left is played over the top of a C7 chord, then the resulting chord is shown on the right.  For example, if a D Major triad is played over a C7, then the resulting chord is a C7(b5).
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Offline T-Block

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Re: Developing Licks With Arpeggios
« Reply #3 on: November 22, 2007, 07:18:24 AM »
Here's a more illustrated version:

-> = over


D Major -> C7 = C7(b5)

Eb Major -> C7 = C7(#9)

Gb Major -> C7 = C7(b5,b9)

Ab Major -> C7 = C7(#5,#9)

A Major -> C7 = C7(b9)

C Minor -> C7 = C7(#9)

Db Minor -> C7 = C7(#5,b9)

Eb Minor -> C7 = C7(b5,#9)

Gb Minor -> C7 = C13(b5,b9)

G Minor -> C7 = C9

A Minor -> C7 = C13
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Offline chevonee

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Re: Developing Licks With Arpeggios
« Reply #4 on: November 22, 2007, 08:09:44 PM »
THanks you guys. So I would play these notes on number one which is D major->C7=  D,F#,A/ C,E,G,Bb and this would create a lick or arpeggio...but it doesn't have to be played in this particular order. This shows me that I still have alot to learn, thanks again you guys. Keep up the good work! ;)
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Offline Virtuenow

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Re: Developing Licks With Arpeggios
« Reply #5 on: December 25, 2007, 06:59:53 AM »
Good post, but what is a lick??  You defined arpeggio; but left "lick" to the unknown.  I already did an internet search but kept coming up with things like "lick me" (haha).  I am assuming those two terms (a & l) are synonymous...There is so much music jargon to learn.  At least I finally know what arpeggio means.

Offline T-Block

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Re: Developing Licks With Arpeggios
« Reply #6 on: December 25, 2007, 07:49:58 AM »
Good post, but what is a lick??  You defined arpeggio; but left "lick" to the unknown.  I already did an internet search but kept coming up with things like "lick me" (haha).  I am assuming those two terms (a & l) are synonymous...There is so much music jargon to learn.  At least I finally know what arpeggio means.

A lick is the same thing as a run or riff, it's just a scale or parts of a scale being played to add flavor.

I ain't even gonna turch the "lick me" comment, LOL.
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Offline Virtuenow

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Re: Developing Licks With Arpeggios
« Reply #7 on: December 25, 2007, 08:54:47 PM »
Thanks T-Block.  I am taking it one term at a time.  I don't think I am ready for the circle of fifths yet.  I have a very broad understanding of it, however.  4's and 5's repeat themselves forward and backwards, right?

Offline T-Block

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Re: Developing Licks With Arpeggios
« Reply #8 on: December 26, 2007, 07:37:32 AM »
Thanks T-Block.  I am taking it one term at a time.  I don't think I am ready for the circle of fifths yet.  I have a very broad understanding of it, however.  4's and 5's repeat themselves forward and backwards, right?

I guess you can look at it like that.  However, on the circle itself, it goes clockwise in 5ths and counter-clockwise in 4ths.
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Re: Developing Licks With Arpeggios
« Reply #9 on: December 26, 2007, 09:13:31 AM »
If the triad on the left is played over the top of a C7 chord, then the resulting chord is shown on the right.  For example, if a D Major triad is played over a C7, then the resulting chord is a C7(b5).

You have D Major over C7 listed as a b5 chord, but the 5 is present in the chord, so shouldn't that be a #11 seeing as you have the 7 and 9?

Wouldn't a D Major over C7 be a C13#11 chord?

C-E-G-Bb/D-Gb-A

Bb is the 7,
D is the 9,
Gb is the #11,
A is the 13.

This looks to me like a C13#11

Offline darkwing

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Re: Developing Licks With Arpeggios
« Reply #10 on: December 26, 2007, 09:57:50 AM »
You have D Major over C7 listed as a b5 chord, but the 5 is present in the chord, so shouldn't that be a #11 seeing as you have the 7 and 9?

Wouldn't a D Major over C7 be a C13#11 chord?

C-E-G-Bb/D-Gb-A

Bb is the 7,
D is the 9,
Gb is the #11,
A is the 13.

This looks to me like a C13#11

Yes, you're right.  I guess in my mind I was thinking of the left hand as playing a shell voicing - just the third and seven (and maybe the root).  This leaves out the 5, and makes a D/C7 a V7(b5,13).  I wasn't very clear.  We had a long debate about chord names in another thread and I haven't gotten around to updating my site appropriately.  Thanks for the reminder.  ;)
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Offline musallio

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Re: Developing Licks With Arpeggios
« Reply #11 on: December 27, 2007, 05:41:10 PM »
Great discussion here 8)

would I be wrong in calling the C13#11 a C13(-5)?
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Offline T-Block

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Re: Developing Licks With Arpeggios
« Reply #12 on: December 27, 2007, 08:28:15 PM »
Great discussion here 8)

would I be wrong in calling the C13#11 a C13(-5)?

Yes, you would be wrong because there is a regular 5 already present.  If that Gb was the only 5th present, then you would call it a C13 b5.
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Offline musallio

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Re: Developing Licks With Arpeggios
« Reply #13 on: December 28, 2007, 01:17:08 AM »
Thanx 4 that clear explanation T-Block 8)
It's always good never 2 assume.

Now I know that I cannot have the same number in a chord..just like each scale must have different letters between A& G. {RIGHT?}
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Offline Steelpulz

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Re: Developing Licks With Arpeggios
« Reply #14 on: December 28, 2007, 02:24:04 AM »
In any given key, there will be only one letter A-G whether it is natural, sharp or flat. E.g. if the key you are in has a "Bb", then there will not be any other "B" (sharp, flat or natural) in that key. However, that doesn't mean that the composer won't write a chord that contains another type of "B". But, that "B" won't be in the given key.

For example, in the key of "C" there is a "B" but no "Bb". However many songs in the key of "C" contain "C7" chords, in which the "7" of the chord is a "Bb".
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Offline T-Block

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Re: Developing Licks With Arpeggios
« Reply #15 on: December 28, 2007, 10:59:02 AM »
Thanx 4 that clear explanation T-Block 8)
It's always good never 2 assume.

Now I know that I cannot have the same number in a chord..just like each scale must have different letters between A& G. {RIGHT?}

EXACTLY!!!

In any given key, there will be only one letter A-G whether it is natural, sharp or flat. E.g. if the key you are in has a "Bb", then there will not be any other "B" (sharp, flat or natural) in that key. However, that doesn't mean that the composer won't write a chord that contains another type of "B". But, that "B" won't be in the given key.

For example, in the key of "C" there is a "B" but no "Bb". However many songs in the key of "C" contain "C7" chords, in which the "7" of the chord is a "Bb".
Get it? No? Don't worry, you will get it.


Your explanation is good, except I would change everywhere u got the word "key" to "major scale".  I keep trying to explain that every note and chord is theoretically a part of every key.  The major scale is different, there are only 7 distinct notes that can be part of a particular major scale.  U agree wit that?
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Offline musallio

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Re: Developing Licks With Arpeggios
« Reply #16 on: December 28, 2007, 11:34:18 AM »
In any given key, there will be only one letter A-G whether it is natural, sharp or flat. E.g. if the key you are in has a "Bb", then there will not be any other "B" (sharp, flat or natural) in that key. However, that doesn't mean that the composer won't write a chord that contains another type of "B". But, that "B" won't be in the given key.

For example, in the key of "C" there is a "B" but no "Bb". However many songs in the key of "C" contain "C7" chords, in which the "7" of the chord is a "Bb".
Get it? No? Don't worry, you will get it.


Undersdtood perfectly..

& thanx 4 clarifying T-Block..
I'm so excited bcos I'll be teaching our church "cat" all the right stuff 8)
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Offline Steelpulz

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Re: Developing Licks With Arpeggios
« Reply #17 on: December 28, 2007, 11:47:57 AM »
EXACTLY!!!

Your explanation is good, except I would change everywhere u got the word "key" to "major scale".  I keep trying to explain that every note and chord is theoretically a part of every key.  The major scale is different, there are only 7 distinct notes that can be part of a particular major scale.  U agree wit that?

I agree that every note and chord is theoretically a part of every key and that my explanation more appropriately fits the term "major scale" as opposed to "key". The more I think about your approach, it would seem to work with some other scales also.
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Offline MemphisKeys

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Re: Developing Licks With Arpeggios
« Reply #18 on: January 09, 2008, 09:30:51 PM »
When should you do tricks and licks and how do you develop the speed for them
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Offline darkwing

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Re: Developing Licks With Arpeggios
« Reply #19 on: January 10, 2008, 12:19:28 AM »
When should you do tricks and licks and how do you develop the speed for them

Good places for licks are the turnaround at the end of a chorus or when the singers aren't singing.  You don't need to fit a lick into every chorus.  Maybe just once or twice in the whole song.  Listen to you favorite artist's placement of licks.

The neat thing is that licks are exercises in themselves.  Take a portion of a lick and practice it up or down by half-steps or whole-steps.  Suppose the segment you are looking at is Ab, A, C, D, F.  Play this up a half-step:  A, Bb, Db, Eb, Gb.  Then do it again until you wind up back at the beginning.  Practice this exercise slowly with a metronome or drum track and slowly increase the speed as you become more agile.  If you can read sheet music, then I strongly suggest Hanon's exercises.

God Bless!

DW
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